Well, since I was also addicted to drugs, and often on public toilets, not sitting there to cruise but to shoot up, there were also police raids where I was taken to the police station.

There I experienced verbal abuse, like one of them saying, can’t you get me some gay porn, making a joke of it.

It was uncomfortable.

You’ve already been arrested and then four, five, six people stand there humiliating you as if it’s all voluntary.

I had the feeling that this police officer, who was pretty young, around 25, was actually a bit turned on by it.

Well, it happened to me once when I was on a public toilet during another police raid, and the police decided to have some fun with it.

This was in the city centre, and they took us in the police van all the way out to Spandau Forest.

That meant that, since most of us didn’t have money for the beef au gay, we had to walk a few kilometres just to get back to the U -Bahn.

That was the Ruhleben U -Bahn station.

And this didn’t only happen to me.

I heard of others who were dropped off in Grunewald or Brunau, and so on.

They got a kick out of it.

Already, at the end of the 70s, early 80s, as I said, we weren’t so out in public.

Everything was still under cover.

So as I said, you’d first ring the bell, see who was coming in, if you knew them.

The windows facing outwards were set up so no one could see inside, so everything was hidden, and naturally there was a certain tension.

For example, at WUWU or KC, Kleist casino, there were back doors, not just the main entrance, but emergency exits.

I remember when there was a raid, the emergency exits were open so that, for example, minors who were also in there, or people who had something to hide, could escape.

Even regular homosexuals or married men who didn’t want to get caught because it was still a negative thing back then.

I was also still a minor when I was in the gay scene.

I was 15 and a half, and then there was a raid at WUWU.

The owner let me out through the emergency exit so he wouldn’t get in trouble, as I was still a minor.

It was only 18 and up, and at the time you weren’t even legally an adult until 21, in my day in 74, 75.

It’s changed since then.

Then suddenly someone yelled cops, and the owner, Uwe, grabbed me, and there was an emergency exit since there were three bars, and he quickly got me out.

Then I went to the next place, and after it was over, I went back to hear what had happened.

Well, it was an ID check.

They collected the IDs, took down the names because they kept a list.

You know, it was pretty much an open secret that homosexuals in West Berlin, when they were ID checked, were put on an internal list.

It was recorded who was gay, because there were also criminals on public toilets, like junkies and so on.

Public toilets were under surveillance.

Now, there’s a designated gay liaison in the police, because within the structure of the police, homosexuality was seen as unmanly, and the officers also always presented themselves as very masculine.

That’s why there was abuse.

I myself experienced it several times.

And as I mentioned in the other interview, the toilets were watched, especially after HIV and AIDS came up.

They wanted to shut them down altogether, along with the three saunas in West Berlin.

And for us, whenever we saw the police, we’d flee from the park or from the toilet if we could, because like I said, I experienced it in the late 70s or early 80s, that raids took place in gay bars or clubs.

And as I said, I know from firsthand experience that homosexuals who were ID checked, whether they had an outstanding warrant or whatever, it was marked.

And there was an internal list noting who was homosexual.

And that was, I mean, that was a complete no go.

Those were Stasi -like methods, or like those used during the Third Reich.

But since we’re talking about police discrimination, I mean, not all of them are like that, but there was discrimination.

Back in that time, from the mid 70s to the mid 80s, or even longer, there was discrimination against homosexuals in the police.

I experienced it myself, when I was once arrested.

And they found out that I was homosexual, they made stupid comments.

They drove me from Sudsturm back home because they wanted to see my apartment.

And stated that I was on unemployment benefits.

And they drove me home to see how I lived.

I told them I live here with my boyfriend, it’s his apartment, and I’m a lodger, and we split all the costs.

Three weeks later, I found a job.

That’s how it was.

There was discrimination against homosexuals.

That’s why they eventually introduced liaison officers at the police, where you could go.

This was a liaison for gays and lesbians.